He’s been denied 18 times and has his next chance in 2009. There are only 13 third baseman in the HOF and 3 of them are from the ***** leagues. Here’s Santo’s stats compared to some guys already in the HOF. Also keep in mind Santo did all of this playing with Diabetes.
Ron Santo – 14 seasons – .277 AVG, 342 HR, 1,331 RBI, 9 time All-Star, 5 time Gold Glove
Eddie Matthews – 16 seasons – .271 AVG, 512 HR, 1,453 RBI, 12 time All-Star, 0 Gold Gloves
Brooks Robinson – 22 seasons, .267 AVG, 268 HR, 1,357 RBI, 18 time All-Star, 16 Gold Gloves
Wade Boggs – 17 seasons, .328 AVG, 118 HR, 1,014 RBI, 12 time All-Star, 2 Gold Gloves
Mike Schmidt – 17 seasons, .267 AVG, 548 HR, 1,595 RBI, 12 time All-Star, 10 Gold Gloves
George Kell – 14 seasons, .306 AVG, 78 HR, 870 RBI, 10 time All-Star, 0 Gold Gloves
Do you think he belongs in the HOF? Do you think he will eventually get in to the HOF? Why do you think he hasn’t already been inducted?
14
Jun 2009
Does Ron Santo Belong In The Hall Of Fame?
By 25 Comments
The best argument is to compare him to George Kell.
Mathews and Schmidt are in for their homers.
Brooks for his glove and Boggs for his hits.
Santo’s main problem is he did everything very good (but not great).
I say if George Kell is in then why isn’t Santo?
YES – When Ronnie retired he was the 2nd best 3rd baseman of all time, stat wise. even more impressive he did it all w/ diabetes
EDIT – hey guy below me, he had the 2nd best stats in history at 3rd, at the time he retired.
Yes.
I hope so.
Underappreciated in his own time, and continuing to this day.
the second reply here has it totally wrong…..You don’t induct someone into the hall of fame cuz he struggled with diabeties..We want him in the HOF cuz he was a darn good player!
Yes he belongs.
I hope he does, and the sooner the better.
Why he isn’t in – sportswriters who had the first chance were pinheads. Veterans Committee also pinheads, but also don’t seem to really induct anyone at all, Guess they are afraid that if their little club gets more members, it won’t be worth as much.
And to Dumbredsoxfan – I must have missed when this gentleman mentioned Santo’s diabetes? Can you show me where he said it? I hope you looked at Robinson’s stats – look pretty damn similar. So I am assuming that, since stats are all that matter, that you feel Robinson doesn’t belong in either. I think you should call the HOF immediately, and get his butt tossed out. They kind of remind me of Jim Rice’s stats as well. Guess maybe you are right – definitely not worthy.
Yes, he is a great guy! He does a lot of stuff for JDRF. I am a diabetic as well and he is an inspiration to me, even though I am a White Sox fan. But the diabetes shouldn’t ahve affected the way he played too much, but for all of the great things he did on and off the field, YES!
But I have a feeling he won’t be in. Just a feeling, but I really hope he gets in. He is so deserving! It will let kids with Diabetes that they can still play great even if they have the disease!
Yes.
As does Gil Hodges: 18 seasons, 273 AVG., 370 HR, 1,274 RBI, 8 time All-Star, 3 Gold Gloves (received first Gold Glove when the award was given to the best major leaguer at the position). He also has the second most HRs in the major leagues for the years 1950-1959 and the most RBIs in the National League for the same years. He also holds the record for Sacrifice Flies in a season — 19 in 1954. A well-respected man and decorated WWII Marine.
Neither will make it in, though. The Veteran’s Committee, in its infinite wisdom, has chosen no one on its last two ballots. The same guys (plus a few more younger players) will vote again in 2009. What’s to change their minds?
Bill Mazeroski? A great player — I’d want him on my team. But a HOF’er?
Yes. Hands down, he belongs in the HOF. And no, not because of his diabetes. The voting shouldn’t be influenced by his disease, but by the way he carried himself and played on the field, and he did that. Santo played in an era with the BEST major league hitters anybody has seen the past almost 100 years and still put up respectable numbers along with being a wall down at 3rd base. There have been players in each decade not deserving the induction that have made it into the HOF, so I really don’t understand why he hasn’t made it.
I always liked Santo, he was a fine player.
I think that he compares favorably with some of the other third basemen on your list if you look at it close enough. A criterion for selection is dominance at your position. Five gold gloves and nine all stars might indicate that in any era not owned by Brooks Robinson. That is why he never was chosen.
I’d like to see him go, but I don’t know that I will
sorry the stats say no.you feel bad cuz he was really sick and battled like crazy to live.however that wont get you in the hall.the avg.,the hrs all to low.he was not a dominant player in his time.
Absolutely, he belongs in the Hall of Fame.
I don’t think he’ll get in any time soon…
He hasn’t been inducted because a lot of voters think his offensive stats were inflated by playing in Wrigley Field… but even if that’s true, the other fact is that he also played during the toughest hitters era of the last 80 to 90 years… the 1960s.
Bill James ranks Santo as the #6 third baseman in MLB history (as of 2000)… and with good reason.
The players ranked ahead of Santo are Schmidt, Brett, Eddie Mathews, Wade Boggs and Home Run Baker, and Santo is ranked ahead of Brooks Robinson , Paul Molitor, Stan Hack and Darrell Evans, who rounds out the top 10.
One point that James makes is that Santo is better than MOST of the thrid basemen who have been elected to the HOF, and this is true despite the fact that there are far fewer 3rd basemen in the HOF than players from any other position.
(in other words, even though 3rd basemen have the toughest time getting in, Santo is still a far better player than most of the 3rd basemen who have made it).
Players who were nowhere near as good as Santo were inducted into the HOF in the 1940s.
Players who were nowhere near as good as Santo were inducted into the HOF in the 1950s.
Players who were nowhere near as good as Santo were inducted into the HOF in the 1960s.
Players who were nowhere near as good as Santo were inducted into the HOF in the 1970s (lots of them).
Players who were nowhere near as good as Santo were inducted into the HOF in the 1980s.
Players who were nowhere near as good as Santo were inducted into the HOF in the 1990s.
The HOF has continually inducted guys decade after decade who are nowhere near as good as Santo was.
In James’ words, Santo “towers above the real standard for the Hall of Fame”…and he’s right.
When it comes to HOF voting, you can’t give Santo extra credit because he has diabetes. It’s all about what you did on the field, under whatever the circumstances were at the time.
I didn’t realize he had diabetes. I definitely think that he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame because he has done as much as some of the other Hall of Famers like Robinson & Mathews. I am huge fans of theirs! I heard Brooks is playing in the legends sports challenge soon? Anyway, Santo has done a great job & he has even played less seasons than some of the other guys. Hopefully he’ll get in the Hall of Fame this year!
He was good no doubt about that. His RC is only worth $40 and that is from the 1962 set so that shows you what the average fan thinks.
Santo vs. Robinson. Santo a vastly superior offensive player….not even close. And while Robinson is hailed as the greatest defensive 3b of all time, Santo’s 5 gold gloves suggest he was the best of his era in the NL. What’s the difference? Robinson played for a winner and was able to showcase his talents in October. And there are other less deserving players already in. Santo not in the Hall is a travesty.
Yes, Ron Santo is well deserving of the title of a hof player. Why you would say no just confuses the heck out of me. Looking at other third baseman that were voted into the hof he was better than three of them including brooks robinson who i see no reason should be in the hall if Santo’s not.
Does Santo belong in the Hall of Fame? Is he better than Brooks Robinson? If Santo had played in Baltimore’s old Memorial stadium for 14 years he wouldn’t have hit 200 hrs. If Brooks played in Wrigley for 22 years he hits over 400 hrs. Brooks was unparrelled as a defensive 3rd baseman and was a decent batter in one of the Major’s toughest parks to hit in. Cubs fans want Santo in the Hall, that would mean that along with Ernie Banks, Billy Williams and Ferguson Jenkins the Cubs of that era would have 4 Hall of Famers. That’s just ridiculous. If the Cubs really have 4 HOFers; where are all the pennants and world series? Let’s get real.The Cubbies were a bottom feeding team that played defense as an after thought. I know that Santo won 5 gold gloves but thats only because they had to give the award to someone.
Ron Santo does belong in the Hall of Fame. I remember him with a rocket of an arm, and dangerous power and clutch hitter. In those days the Mets and Cubs were in the same division and most of the 18 games they played againset each other each season were televised.
Brooks Robinson was not his competition. There was none better at 3B in the NL in those days. I grew up in New York and saw enough of these guys on TV against the Mets and Yankees. Both were the ultimate.
When you compare players of any era , these guys were the best at that position in that generation.
My recollection is Santo was grouchy to sportswriters and my own experience with journalists has shown that some will find revenge some way.
I am a cardinal fan. Yes he should and should have been way before he will be inducted
With the exception of 1969 and, perhaps, 1970, Ron Santo racked up his incredibly impressive stats playing for what might be the worst teams to have been fielded in the post-50′s era. And he did so in front of measly, pathetic, anemic audiences. And don’t believe the attendance stats. Pre-1969, if the Cubs said there were as many as 2,000 people in the stands–and that was on a GOOD day!–Santo was working his butt off every day in front of 500 to 2,000 people. And he was doing everything (other than base-running) extremely well. This is a no-brainer. He should be in the Hall, on his playing record alone. When you factor all the other “non-playing” criteria in–his ongoing philanthropic work for diabetes, his work as a sportscaster, his formidable outreach in supporting youth programs in baseball, the writers and the Vets Committee should be ashamed of themselves. Bravo on a masterful career as a player, and thank you for your outstanding contributions as a citizen, Mr. Santo. You are a class act!
What the bare statistics don’t show is that during the mid-to-late 1960′s (Santo’s best seasons) was a period when the baseball rules favored pitching: strike zone, height of mound, maybe the liveliness of the baseball. In any case, batters in general had a tougher time — check the league averages — than they did in Schmidt’s time, or Boggs’s, or Kell’s. And George Kell played during WWII, when pitching was REALLY easy to hit. When you normalize the stats, Santo’s hitting looks even better. He was the best player in the National League during 1967, too, as well as one of the very best for 12 years.
Graig Nettles also deserves consideration . People like Ozzie Smith get in so easily just for their glove work . Third basemen rarely get the credit they deserve . Nettles was one of the best fielders ever and hit a ton of homers pre steroids . And from what I remember about Ron Santo was how good he was on those near do well Cubs teams of the 60s and 70s . He belongs in the HOF . It’s just too bad he will never know if he gets in now . Jim Rice does not belong in , neither does Jack Morris . There are so many people with stats comparable to those two . Santo was a way better player than Rice ever was .Somehow all his whining got him in .
Nettles 2225 hits , 1193 runs 390 HOMERUNS ,1314 rbi . Two gold gloves, playing at the same time as Brooks Robinson obviously ruined his chances for more . he had a low batting average . .248 . But overall probably belongs in over some other people . He was a better player than Ozzie Smith for sure .
Yes. Not a Cubs fan, and for years didn’t think he should be in the HOF, but I have changed my mind. A major factor not often discussed is the era in which he played–the infamous dead ball era, where pitchers dominated with low ERA. If you hit 15 homers, you were considered a power hitter. Santo in today’s game plays longer, as age related decline occurs later. Santo also should get credit (as should Torre) for his contributions to the game outside the lines. Stats aren’t everything, yet Santo’s are still good enough to warrant my vote. If the ’69 Cubs don’t fall apart down the stretch, perhaps Ronnie gets in before he was cremated…Vote YES.
Admit I am unfamiliar with George Kell? Hard to figure how he got into the HOF with those stats.
As to Ron Santos being excluded from the HOF while lesser players are there; I say that is faulty reasoning. It is unfortunate that there are some players in the HOF that probably should NOT be in. The Hall of Fame is supposed to be the best-of-the-best. The elite.
If anything, they should raise the standard for selection to the HOF. Yet stats only tell a portion of the tale and not always well. Look at Bert Blylevin who played many years on terrible teams?? He FINALLY got selected. Stats also do not show the intangibles which some may not think should be considered. Yet that is just my point. The Hall of Fame should ONLY include those elite players with the stats AND the intangibles…………….the complete package.
To “Baltbird” – I assume from your name you’re an Orioles fan. Think if Brooks was playing on our recent teams – they are what the Cubs were for most of Santo’s career, terrible. WGN was only in Chicago, so most fans never saw him play. No pitching, no winning. That’s the game. Memorial Stadium had a 309 left field foot fence, compared to Wrigley’s 355, so your argument is really dumb. By the way, Brooks Robinson has been telling everyone for years that Santo belongs in the HOF.